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grey-area1 day ago | parent | context | favorite | on: Tesla Roadster Falls in a controlled way would be more accurate. This isn’t a flying car, which could conceivably have some use (like a personal aircraft). It’s a stunt to distract the gullible from Tesla financials, which do not justify the valuation. As you say, it’s not practical in production and never will be. Musk clearly wants to merge all his companies, so that it’s too big to fail, and this probably came out of the questions that arise from that - how can we use Spacex tech at Tesla? help 
Already__Taken1 day ago | next[–] Its sold as invite only, basically just selling your own amusement park ride. Its not a car. They're trying to up-brand into that hyper-car market. reply grey-area1 day ago | parent | next[–] There’s no way this will ever directly make back the salaries and time spent on it so far. It’s not a way to make money for Tesla. So no, Musk is trying to prepare the ground for a merger with spacex and distract from Tesla’s worsening fundamentals and the flop of cyber truck, the decade late delivery of roadster etc etc. reply AYBABTME1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] All this stuff was in motion while Tesla was in its COVID boom. It's hard to believe that this is all some PR stunt due to Tesla's current market posture, when the Cybertruck, Roadster, were all specced the same in 2021. It's not like they suddenly came up with these gimmicks. The gimmicks were there from day one. reply Geezus_421 day ago | root | parent | next[–] Always keep a distraction in your pocket. You never know when you might need it. reply bestham1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] Learn from the best: Maskirovka reply Geezus_427 hours ago | root | parent | next[–] Maskirovka (Russian: маскировка, literally meaning "masking" or "camouflage") is a long-standing Russian and Soviet military doctrine of deception, denial, and misdirection. reply josephg1 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] Depends how much they sell them for. It could probably make the investment back if they price it at $5M or something and sell 100 of them to the ultra rich. reply sumeno1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] That would involve turning a carefully controlled magic trick into a production vehicle that can do the same trick anywhere They will never sell a car with similar functionality to that demo to anyone reply josephg1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] > They will never sell a car with similar functionality to that demo to anyone They're explicitly advertising selling exactly that car. They just say it's by "invitation only". Do you think it's just a marketing gimmick? I dunno who's crazy enough to buy one. But for the right price, they could definitely sell a few. reply grey-area1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] They’ve been selling that car with deposits for 10 years without delivering. Will they deliver this time? I’m sure adding jet packs from SpaceX rockets will make that much easier! reply jordanb1 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] > They're explicitly advertising selling exactly that car Priced at $420k I imagine. reply propaganja1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] That's absurdly low IMO. I can't imagine it'll go for less than a mil. I reckon $1.5M - $3M reply jordanb1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] Ok $690k or $4.20M There's no way he doesn't go for meme pricing on this stunt reply bloaf1 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] I could maybe see a major movie studio buying one or two, but I think the major problem with the stunt functionality is not so much making the vehicle, its finding a building/structure where it is safe to hang a multi-ton vehicle off the wall or the ceiling. reply dbspin1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] Never gonna happen. It's trivial to do this with CGI, there'd be no advantage, and a whole heck of a lot of liability doing it practically. reply josephg16 hours ago | root | parent | next[–] You say that. And yet, most of mad max: fury road was filmed practically. It looks amazing. I could easily imagine the right films renting these cars for a stunt. Film cameras and practical effects are having a resurgence. reply Levitating1 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] > There’s no way this will ever directly make back the salaries and time spent on it so far. It does if it keeps their valuation in the trillions. reply d1sxeyes1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] I think 'directly' is doing a lot of work in OP's comment. I agree, this is never going to make sales that pay for the engineering effort involved in this machine, but keeping Tesla in the news, having this amazing POC, and the lessons learned that might apply to other parts of Musk's enterprises (SpaceX particularly) are not worth zero. Plus, whatever you think of Musk, this is really fucking cool. reply jordanb1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] > Plus, whatever you think of Musk, this is really fucking cool. Evel Knievel did some cool things at well. In fact he made a rocket car and even flew in it! He also didn't lie to people and collect deposits promising he'd sell them a rocket car. reply d1sxeyes22 hours ago | root | parent | next[–] > He also didn't lie to people and collect deposits promising he'd sell them a rocket car. It might be worth reading up on Evel Knievel... reply grey-area1 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] I don’t think much of Musk since the Nazi salutes, but why is this really cool? It’s taking work done for rockets which are cool IMO (the control systems and software will all be from those) and sticking it on a car to make a circus act out of it. I do have a problem with the fake spectacle of it and don’t think it’s cool in any way. reply peripitea1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] I think we've lost the plot a little bit if we don't understand why a car that can stick to the road upside down and kick flip over traffic is cool. reply grey-area1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] It’s not a real car, you’ll never buy it, and it’ll never be road legal so it won’t be near traffic. reply peripitea1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] Yeah and if you do a kickflip over traffic your drinks will fall out of your cupholder. If that's your standard for cool I don't know what to tell you. reply locknitpicker1 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] > There’s no way this will ever directly make back the salaries and time spent on it so far. It’s not a way to make money for Tesla. Tesla in particular and all Elon Musk's ventures aren't exactly renowned for being sound investments. Even snake oil salesmen were seen as proper entrepreneurs at one point. Personally I can't shake off the feeling that every single announcement is a con job, starting with the autonomous driving claims. I'm baffled why people still put any trust into anyyhing coming out of that field. reply trophycase1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] autonomous driving is a con job? You can stop the trolley at any point but doing so would admit you were wrong. reply ShinyLeftPad1 day ago | parent | prev | next[–] It's not the actual car that will be sold but apparently another prototype. Actually, title of the submission should be changed to "Tesla Roadster new prototype". For the record, previous prototype was in 2017 and the real deal was supposed to ship in 2020 reply grey-area1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] Yes and instead of shipping a new roadster after 10 years we get this - a flying car•. • For certain values of flying reply ShinyLeftPad1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] we get another prototype that is evidently not even safe for a human to be in during demo. it's a good trick tho, hey, now it's a flying car, so we gotta delay it more. that way they can delay the release and just collect pre order money infintely;) reply Geezus_421 day ago | root | parent | next[–] And still never build that 30k Tesla... reply bretpiatt1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] He initially stated in 2011: $30,000 in 2011 is worth $44,937.52 today. New Model 3 today $36,990 so inflation adjusted already sub-$30k, and if Cybercab cones through even with inflation. reply Geezus_427 hours ago | root | parent | next[–] Who cares about the inflation adjustment. He didn't hedge for inflation when he laid down that number. Then after 16 years he STILL couldn't pull it off. You're making excuses for a trillionaire who would happily watch you starve. reply SEJeff1 day ago | prev | next[–] Tesla’s machine vision research wing became xAI and the compute and resource were transferred over. SpaceX then bought cursor.ai, a small but goated frontier lab. They merged cursor with xAI and it’s now SpaceXAI. So each Tesla uses models trained by SpaceX AI. The model s has always had Inconel in the frame for strength since relatively early on. But the Inconel came from SpaceX. Inconel is primarily used in aerospace applications. It made the frame of the model s so strong it broke the NTHSA machine used to test rollover strength. Look this up it is easy to verify. SpaceX materials science has always been a big part of Tesla’s success since the very early beginning. Likewise inversely. reply jordanb1 day ago | parent | next[–] Ok I looked this up because I found it very strange. Inconel would not be a good choice for an automobile frame. Not only is it expensive and heavy it also can be pretty brittle. You want a frame that's strong but ductile so that it will absorb impact energy. From what I've been able to find, Tesla uses inconel in some battery components. This makes sense because the thing inconel is really good at is staying strong even when very hot. This is why it's used in turbines and jet engines. This thread points out that inconel is not unused in the automotive world, high-end ICE cars have used it for their exhaust systems. Another advantage of inconel in this application is that it's highly corrosion resistant: https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/inconel.50251/ So in summary: Tesla uses inconel where it makes sense to use it (to deal with high heat) and so do other automobile manufactures. reply SEJeff14 hours ago | root | parent | next[–] You’re absolutely right and I clearly remembered this incorrectly. I conflated the model S actually breaking the NTHSA press that crushes cars to test rollover strength with the fact that the model s does use Inconel. My apologies. I wasn’t acting in bad faith, just remembered wrong. reply navane1 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] Inconel is indeed extremely hard and thus brittle. Used for high wear and grind parts on heavy machinery, not for framing. reply grey-area1 day ago | parent | prev | next[–] I checked a few sources (including grok) for your inconel in struts claim as it seemed unlikely. They all said it was false. Certainly there has been crossover in both directions, most famously in Musk forcing SpaceX to buy Tesla cybertrucks (18% of production at one point). reply SEJeff14 hours ago | root | parent | next[–] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50138131 reply sanj1 day ago | parent | prev | next[–] I can’t see any documentation of income ever being used on an S. Given that it costs 10x more than aluminum, it is highly unlikely to be useful as a material in a production car. The frame breaking the NHSTA story is correct but is just well-designed aluminum. I’m happy to be shown a reference I’m wrong. reply SEJeff14 hours ago | root | parent | next[–] from an archive of the “Three dog day” Tesla blog post that’s now deleted. Took me a few to dig up, but I wanted the primary source for you. https://archive.is/Q7FFk “”” That was combined with upgrading the main pack contactor to use inconel (a high temperature space-grade superalloy) instead of steel, so that it remains springy under the heat of heavy current. The net result is that we can safely increase the max pack output from 1300 to 1500 Amps. What this results in is a 10% improvement in the 0 to 60 mph time to 2.8 secs and a quarter mile time of 10.9 secs. Time to 155 mph is improved even more, resulting in a 20% reduction. “”” reply user439281 day ago | prev | next[–] Musk already talked about the cold gas thrusters for the Tesla Roadster in 2018. It would seem that your theory that the idea arose out of a need to distract from current financials doesn't hold merit. He probably just wanted to design a cool car. reply jordanb1 day ago | parent | next[–] This was a "the cybertruck will be a boat" style claim. Clearly some time between 2018 and now he decided he'd have to actually have it done and ordered his people to make a stunt car with thrusters. reply grey-area1 day ago | parent | prev | next[–] Wasn’t aware of that detail thanks, it’s such a bizarre idea. I disagree that it couldn’t come out of thinking of how to justify merging spacex and Tesla which he’s wanted to do for a long time. This isn’t a cool car, it’s a gimmick. It will never be road-worthy, would lose money, and I doubt they’ll ever even sell it to customers. As to why he’s going this dog and pony show now, we can only speculate, but I can’t think of any reasons that are good for Tesla (vs Musk personally) can you? reply user439281 day ago | root | parent | next[–] I see little need to speculate here. The obvious explanation would be that this design for the roadster took 8 years to come to fruition for a demo-able prototype. I also very much doubt the 2028 timeline for delivery, and what the purpose of the Rocket edition is. Perhaps it's just a prestige project. The non-flying version at least seems usable on a racing track. reply grey-area1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] The speculation is because it’s such an absurd thing to demo or even aspire to. Nobody wants or needs this. So why do it? I guess the answer is because it was Musk’s whim and nobody dared say no, which doesn’t bode well for Tesla. reply _acco1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] Are you not aware that other auto companies produce concept cars? reply trophycase1 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] Why do anything? Why don't we all live in a joyless, pointless world where nobody does anything on a whim because it doesn't contribute to efficiency and shareholder profits? reply origini1 day ago | parent | prev | next[–] I don't know what stoped him just designing and building the roadster by now or any update or upgrade to it. reply llm_nerd1 day ago | parent | prev | next[–] Musk also said production was starting on the Roadster in 2020. It turns out that things Musk says don't mean much. And it can still be a distraction. The fact that they went through all this effort for a fantastically unreasonable thing just to wow for a company that is off the rails is...pretty telling. Have you never worked with someone who is late for everything, always overpromising and underdelivering, and as it becomes more apparently their promises get more exaggerated and unreasonable? That's Musk. Like "look you can play games on your screen", which absolutely no one asked for in a car, and for which it does much shittier than a $200 pad. For that matter it's Trump too, and they're both cut from the same cloth -- don't like the dumb arch? Well now it has snipers and drones! And also it will eliminate the debt, deficit, income taxes, and... So instead of just starting production of a vehicle 8 years behind schedule, look, new distraction! Amazeballs! Don't worry coming real soon now. Just put in those deposits! I mean, the one part of this story that is unclear and no one seems to be asking hard questions is the compressor status -- there are vague, handwavy (oh we'll build a compressor claims, but I have huge doubts). A 5000 psi to 10000 psi compressor in the real world today is enormous. It's industrial equipment that generates enormous amounts of heat, is hilariously loud, and takes enormous power. While I am 100% certain this dog and pony show had their tanks filled by external massive compressors out of sight, I am pretty skeptical Tesla has any magic innovation in that field. reply user439281 day ago | root | parent | next[–] It can hardly be a "new distraction" when it was evidently planned and announced in 2018. I also find it unconvincing that the purpose of the stunt is to receive deposits. This being a prestige project to show off Tesla's advantage in experimental technology, or a personal pet project, would seem a much more likely explanation. Do we really need to bend everything into a malicious scam? reply theshackleford1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] > Do we really need to bend everything into a malicious scam? You should be asking Elon that. reply llm_nerd1 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] When it's by a repeat scammer, yes. Like, good god. Hey remember when all of the Tesla factories were being retooled to make robots, and the hilarious robot demo where some remote controlled junk was pitched as next gen? Also SpaceX would be to Mars by 2021, and would have landed a crew there in 2023. Totes! Musk is Elizabeth Holmes who lucked into buying a growing business. Like, he 100% does exactly what Theranos did, and which she is sitting in jail for, trying to boost the stock on bullshit and lies. "prestige project to show off Tesla's advantage" Advantage? The entire engineering world is going "why?", for a wide range of reasons. Not unlike the CyberJunk nonsense where he needed to boast that it can stop bullets and double as a boat (https://nationalpost.com/news/world/cybertruck-texas-wade-mo...) and is made out of impractical materials. That massive, colossal flop didn't show any "advantage", it showed that a toddler was running the show, and when people just want cars he's off desperately trying to regain his Iron man allure, now that he's just a vile, garbage human being. reply SEJeff1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] They shut down model x and s production to retool those Fremont lines for Optimus robots. They actually are making them btw. They’re using them in their own factories currently just like they used the Tesla semi for like two years for their own freight before selling them to the public. reply jordanb1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] > They shut down model x and s production to retool those Fremont lines for Optimus robots. Another narrative that also fits the facts is that demand for their cars is so bad that they had to idle the X and S lines at that factory and they used Optimus as an excuse. If demand was booming they'd set up a new facility to manufacture Optimus rather than dismantling a car factory reply SEJeff20 hours ago | root | parent | next[–] They’ve wanted to shut down the s and x lines since the y and 3 were first being manufactured at scale. His timelines are always wrong but Elon has said this for years. reply turtlesdown111 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] > Do we really need to bend everything into a malicious scam? Fool me once, shame on you, fool me 10 times, shame on me Wild people are still falling for Musk's fake products. I guess what they say is true, there is a sucker born every minute despite the evidence of the last twenty years. This will never ship. reply trophycase1 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] I bet car engineers really hated working on something cool and fun instead of the 10th boring iteration of this year's model. reply llm_nerd1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] This is a particularly hilarious take. Especially after Tesla's actually interesting vehicles were abandoned from cratering sales so they can focus on a ridiculous DumpsterBox that also is an enormous flop. Must have been "cool and fun" making the stupidest looking vehicle in history, but also it's terrible at every single thing you'd use a truck for. So cool. So fun. Now they needed to make a worthless Theranos display to fool gullible suckers, in a farcical display. It's all quite amazing. And I mean, if there is one thing that Elon is renowned for, it's how great he is as a boss, and how much he thinks about his future Soylent Green. That he has pathetic fanboys who rush around defending him is utterly perverse, but such is the world we live in today. reply coffeebeqn1 day ago | prev | next[–] I mean in theory if it did work you could use it to take shortcuts or go over very difficult terrain or a flood or something but I don’t think traffic or aviation laws are anywhere near to allowing that reply Reason0771 day ago | parent | next[–] Maybe it could be sold as a safety feature. Suppose you accidentally drive your car off a cliff. Accelerometers and other sensors (cameras) could detect the fall and activate the cold gas thrusters to rotate the car into a safe orientation and bring it to a soft landing. It should even be possible to use the thrusters as an emergency braking system in case of loss of traction, rollovers, departing the roadway, etc, to avoid or reduce impact damage and injuries. reply pants21 day ago | root | parent | next[–] In theory it could be a car that avoids nearly every accident. Say you're at a red light behind a semi truck and an SUV is about to rear end you. The car could detect the impending crash and lift you up and away from danger. A supercar that can't crash would be very popular among the ultra rich even at 5 mil a pop. reply turtlesdown111 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] > Maybe it could be sold as a safety feature. Yeah, loading high pressure gas into tanks in your vehicle structure is a "safety feature"... reply micromacrofoot1 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] it won't be street legal pretty much anywhere, to quash any further speculation reply Nevermark1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] I would love a non-street legal car ... that didn't need streets. The car is fun as a concept. Amazing as a demo. And the actual street legal versions will still be fun and amazing to drive relative to "ordinary" hypercar criteria. reply micromacrofoot22 hours ago | root | parent | next[–] "hypercars" should be illegal on streets too reply malablaster1 day ago | prev[–] I don’t see Musk as a nefarious actor; more of a nerd — albeit a visionary one — who is socially awkward but got unfathomably rich and powerful. reply origini1 day ago | parent | next[–] I don't think any 'evil' person sees themselves as 'evil'. But pushing himself onto the President, manipulating democracy and being responsible for killing kids as a billionair makes his actions nefarious. reply Nevermark1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] > a nerd — albeit a visionary one — who is socially awkward but got unfathomably rich and powerful That part is true. > manipulating democracy and being responsible for killing kids as a billionair makes his actions nefarious. Indeed. I think the admirable + despicable combination creates unprocessable dissonance for some people. People then take one side or another. reply greggoB1 day ago | parent | prev | next[–] His antics vis-à-vis propping up the far-right in Europe or calling people he doesn't like NPCs don't persuade you otherwise? reply jwr1 day ago | parent | prev | next[–] His Nazi salute doesn't bother you in the least? That's not "socially awkward". reply the_gipsy1 day ago | parent | prev | next[–] Stop anthropomorphizing billionaires. reply jabron1 day ago | parent | prev | next[–] Those are not at all mutually exclusive. In fact, both of those characteristics make up most of the Silicon Valley oligarchy. reply anhner1 day ago | parent | prev | next[–] Then you haven't been paying attention. reply ndsipa_pomu1 day ago | parent | prev | next[–] Are you not aware of his blatant Nazi salutes or his DOGE attempt to dismantle oversight/regulation of his business concerns or him cancelling USAID (700,000 deaths and counting) or his interference in UK/European politics to promote far right violence and riots? If you had that amount of money and power, you could be anyone you wanted, so why on earth does Musk choose to be as he is? reply thfuran1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] Or the vote buying reply shevy-java1 day ago | parent | prev | next[–] He recently shut down Starlink for Ukrainians, thus contributing to Putin's genocide. Have you not been reading the news? Calling Musk a "nerd" is the wrong term here. That is deliberate support of a genocide. reply hcurtiss1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] But he didn’t. Starshield is used for military operations and it is controlled by the US government, not Musk.[1] Starlink cannot be used for offensive military applications. Those that try are shut off entirely. If Ukraine is illegally using consumer Starlink in drones (which would not work particularly well), SpaceX wouldn’t even know which receivers to turn off. If they did, they’d turn them off entirely, not slow them as is alleged. [1] https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2026/10/15/what-is-starshield... reply hcurtiss1 day ago | parent | prev[–] The Musk invective in HN is just wild to me. No, it wasn’t a Nazi salute (unless Biden, and Hillary and Obama are all Nazis too having made the same motion). No, he hasn’t cut Ukraine’s internet. All of these are lies, repeated over and over and over. He’s just a Republican accelerationist and unapologetic about his race. His companies create legitimately awesome products that millions use daily. Shocking that today that’s enough to breed such extraordinary hate from the left. reply nilamo1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] > No, it wasn’t a Nazi salute Talk all you want, but video is available for you to make up your own mind. Imo, it was very obviously a Nazi salute coupled with an angry face reminiscent of Hitler, and then repeated to make sure it was seen. reply trophycase1 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] It really is pretty embarrassing that the forum of a venture capital accelerator is debatably the most anti-tech, anti-capitalist tech forum on the internet. Now I remember why I stopped coming here. Just goes to show how these types of forums always get infiltrated and taken over by tankies... see reddit/wikipedia/etc reply BoxwoodSeed1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] Those types don't have to work usually, so they have all the time to waste on the Internet. reply hcurtiss1 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] Agreed. They swarm. reply frankzinger1 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] > No, it wasn’t a Nazi salute (unless Biden, and Hillary and Obama are all Nazis too having made the same motion) Yeah just like this car's motion is the same as that of an aeroplane. reply the_gastropod1 day ago | root | parent | prev | next[–] Go ‘head big dog. Share a single source of Obama, Clinton, or Biden making “the same gesture”. A video, please. No cheap photos of waving hands at just the right moment. reply turtlesdown111 day ago | root | parent | prev[–] Elon Musk is a virulent racist and with DOGE will be directly responsible for the deaths of millions. reply hcurtiss1 day ago | root | parent[–] LOL - and how many were we killing by not funding USAID twice as much? How many are you personally killing by not mortgaging your house and sending the money to African NGOs? The entire angle is so childish. reply the_gastropod1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] Suddenly destroying a massive system of aid, upon which millions had already depended, is very different than not donating to NGO’s. There was even a responsible way to cut that funding, with planning, with forewarning, with cooperation from other nations. This was completely reckless, and will kill millions. reply hcurtiss1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] Yes, I am certain you would’ve been satisfied had they only reduced the funding more slowly. reply the_gastropod1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] “Yea, sure, like those plane crash victims would’ve survived if the plane had just slowed less rapidly! Libtard!” My man. Maybe engage with what people are saying instead of the cartoon version you’ve crafted in your mind. reply hcurtiss1 day ago | root | parent | next[–] And China could have replaced that funding just as rapidly. Or Britain or France. All they needed were the wire instructions. Yet I see no finger wagging their direction. Please stop pretending it’s the pace of defunding that offends you. reply turtlesdown111 day ago | root | parent | prev[–] It takes a special kind of intellectual laziness to believe that comparing a national budget to a personal mortgage is a clever substitute for a logical argument- it's a "choice" to call a position "childish" while relying on a rhetorical strategy that wouldn't pass muster in a middle-school debate. reply
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